Author Topic: A detailed example: kickstarter  (Read 14964 times)

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Offline Dave Chase

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #75 on: May 25, 2013, 10:36:40 AM »
Freedom is the right to speak your mind.

It is also the right to walk away from those you don't want to listen to.

Offline Dave Chase

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #76 on: May 25, 2013, 02:58:16 PM »
Another reason to try and push ahead right now (ie with in a years time) with getting LoS back out into the public is that GW players are looking for something else to play that does not have rule changes every year, figures do not cost more than you utilities and are looking for something a bit more in depth.

I think LoS can fit some of those needs.

Dave Chase
Freedom is the right to speak your mind.

It is also the right to walk away from those you don't want to listen to.

Offline bobloblah

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #77 on: May 25, 2013, 05:58:46 PM »
Wasn't you...didn't work for me, either. I messed up the original formatting, somehow. Should be fixed now.

EDIT: Thanks, Dave. Oh, and I agree, those are all good reasons to strike while the iron is hot, so to speak.
Best Regards,
Bobloblah

Offline grendeljd

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #78 on: May 28, 2013, 07:43:25 PM »
Try it this way

www.forbeck.com/2013/05/23/top-ten-tabletop-kickstarters-how-they-do-it/


Dave Chase

Great article. Robotech Tactics clearly followed that business model. It would be great if we could successfully get to a point where plastic LoS mini's are possible.

Too bad there wasn't a little more info about that in the article other than mentioning its done with 'hard-won knowledge', but then it was just focusing on the Kickstarter facet.

Another reason to try and push ahead right now (ie with in a years time) with getting LoS back out into the public is that GW players are looking for something else to play that does not have rule changes every year, figures do not cost more than you utilities and are looking for something a bit more in depth.

I think LoS can fit some of those needs.

Absolutely. Although, I think disenchanted GW players are in a nearly steady state of supply considering their business plan over the years. As long as they continue to draw in young newbies, they'll eventually burn them out via the expense or the continual rules revisions/overhauls :)
I hate people generally, but I like them specifically - John Malkovich

Offline grendeljd

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #79 on: May 28, 2013, 07:59:47 PM »
Its a very interesting looking game to be sure, but it doesn't quite fire my imagination enough to buy into. There are some really good looking figures, like the giant plague carrier, but some of the others are a little generic looking for my tastes. Not to say they aren't nicely detailed or professionally sculpted, just not hooking me personally.

I like the idea they have for the modular building game pieces - they look really good, and the re-play factor is high with the ability to make a different tabletop each time you play. Its also a great idea to help sell a game that doesn't require you to make up all your own terrain [a daunting task for some].
This is probably the best part of that Kickstarter for me. I notice they have terrain-only pledge levels (with which you can include terrain add-ons), so they apparently realise that this would be the case for a lot of people.

Having new tile sets for a relaunch of LoS will be key, I think tile types that players of the original never had would be very enticing for them as well as new players. Perhaps they could become part of a good stretch goal campaign, maybe even as a whole separate add-on.

I had a conversation with my neighbour this morning about current tabletop mini's on the market, and he mentioned that a lot of them are very similar, almost too generic with their troop type selections. He also said that he really liked the uniqueness of LoS.
That is interesting. It does seem that most games have gone towards hyper-stylized miniatures, reminiscent of Manga. It's the same trend that created the concept piece that's in the gallery here, after all. I think there may still be a pretty significant market for a much less over-the-top sci-fi miniatures along the lines of LoS. Of course, that's just a gut feeling, but it stems from conversations with other miniature gamers.

I am a fan of a lot of the high end modern gaming illustration styles out there [I recently picked up some AT-43 army list supplements - they are just blowing my mind right now]. But I think it is easy to end up doing something that is rather generic amidst a sea of similarity out there. I think a new LoS product needs to compete at the current level of standards, but it has a unique look that should be updated with as much respect to the original vision as possible.

Interesting to note that the Warpath game from Mantic almost feels just like a take-off of classic 40k, with all the typical 'fantasy' races such as orcs, elves, dwarves and rat-people placed in a futuristic setting.
I believe Mantic was formed by a bunch of ex-GW guys, and their original line of Fantasy miniatures (before they even had the Kings of War game) appeared to be intended to directly steal sales from GW by undercutting them. The designer in the Deadzone video was a game designer and White Dwarf editor at GW back in the 90s.

Well now, that makes a lot of sense. Nobody can really sue them for copyright over using the same generic fantasy races as GW, either - lol!

AND they kept it up to date, up to the minute.

They mentioned how impressed they were with the degree of comments people were posting, and they listened & adjusted as they were able to. The level of social-media sharing to spread the word was also immense.
Also immensely important is that sense of two-way communication; it's basically inexpensive marketing, as it taps into people's desire to be heard and appear to be listened to.

Agreed!
« Last Edit: May 28, 2013, 08:10:55 PM by grendeljd »
I hate people generally, but I like them specifically - John Malkovich

Offline smokingwreckage

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #80 on: June 09, 2013, 11:44:44 AM »
Plastic UNE and Machines would be pretty feasible. Only a handful of unique sculpts in that.

Offline Wyatt

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #81 on: June 22, 2013, 10:35:08 AM »
I would think that having all the black box minis in plastic would be in LOS best interest. While start up costs are higher (although that cost has come down considerably more than most think), for such integral figures you'll see a much higher return on your investment. Perhaps if a kickstart is initiated you could make that a stretch goal. Have the initial box set set displayed with metal and/or resin minis. Then if a certain dollar figure is reached a plastic spruce is released and all backers models that are on that spruce will be doubled. You could even divide them have a UNE spruce stretch goal and Machine spruce stretch goal., 

Offline Clark

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #82 on: September 30, 2013, 08:22:17 AM »
I seem to remember reading that Inferno sold really well, and what spiked Global Games was tooling up for a Star Wars game and then having the license-holder lose the license, thus torpedoing the entire thing.

Inferno was sold as a game with paper mapboards and cardboard stand-ups instead of figures, along with a bunch of counters and various blast templates.  Then all the miniatures were sold separately.  I don't know how well the figs sold although I recall many getting good reviews.  The game itself was simultaneously released in multiple languages into the European market and I think the total was about 12,000 copies right out of the gate.  Having the Star Wars deal tank was one thing, the X-Game was another and then I think there were problems in collecting the receivables from some of the European distributors. 

Offline Clark

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #83 on: September 30, 2013, 08:33:53 AM »
On the miniatures, I don't understand why everyone sticks with the 25mm square on their dungeons. Go for 30. Modellers love those round lips. I understand every square being 5mm larger adds up over a map, but it seems like it'd be worth it at the end.

For GenCon '94 we built a 3D board out of foam ( http://www.homedepot.ca/product/durofoam-eps-rigid-insulation-96inch-x-48inch-x-15inch/940442 ).  Since you actually had to worry about the miniatures fitting between the walls, we had to change the ground scale to 1-1/2" squares (about 38mm) which much more closely matches the figure scale.  It looked awesome and was fun to play on but was sort of impractical for home use due to the size and bulk of the foam.

Offline Clark

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Re: A detailed example: kickstarter
« Reply #84 on: September 30, 2013, 10:07:30 AM »
It was "announced" there, if you can call it that, by which I mean it was mentioned it in the Sci-Fi forums. One can debate whether it was the lack of exposure the Kickstarter had (although it was a couple years ago, so that might be why you missed it) or lack of manuscript that killed it, but even with far more exposure I suspect it would have failed because of the latter; Mike was simply asking people to give him $25,000 with a vague promise of eventually delivering something.

I had never heard of Kickstarter until Romain told me about it, and I never looked closely at it until more recently.  The thing about books and even video games going through kickstarter is that you are basically pledging to pay someone's wages be it the artists, the coders or the writer.  A physical product requires non-artistic, technical skills and material costs, with the latter being more significant and a per unit basis.

Matt Forebeck's analysis seems solid: plastic minatures have similar economies of scale to information products such as books and computer games, but also retain some marginal utility of actually owning multiple copies.  An individual does not need two copies of a computer game or a book, although NYX is offering two copies of LOS on different formats if you want one for your PC and one for your phone or tablet.  With miniatures, the more the merrier! Who doesn't want a bigger army?